Saturday, February 5, 2011

Dubya was right all along...

Remember when George W. Bush authorized the U.S. lead invasion into Iraq back in March of 2003? His goal was to rid the world of a menacing tyrant who was directly responsible for a great deal of the instability of the region. In doing so he stated that an emancipated, democratic Iraq would serve as a beacon of hope in the region for others who yearn for freedom, and that it was the human condition to seek liberty and freedom. . He was lambasted as an idiot pie-in-the-sky dreamer, a fool, a dope. Remember all of that? I do. . Now look at what is happening in the Middle East. Iraq is indeed the model that these other countries are now seeking to emulate. Tunisia, Algeria, Jordan, Yemen and most notably Egypt; all citizens of these countries are acutely aware of the freedoms now enjoyed by a relatively stable Iraqi population, and they understandably want some of that for themselves. . Of course, their tyrannical governments want absolutely NONE of that, obviously. . To bow to their citizens and allow free elections and the introduction of capitalism, that would be the end of the dictator's palaces, torture chambers, secret police, and all of the trappings of power that they have enjoyed since the Brits, French and other imperialist 19th century countries were ousted from the region over the last one hundred years or so. . And these tyrants can't have that. . But I suspect that the tyrants currently in power in the Middle East are living their last days in the opulence supported by their looting of their population's resources. Twitter, Face Book, YouTube - tyrants have met their match in restricting the flow of information. The cat is out of the bag, and their populations have seen how others in their region are enjoying liberty and freedom. . It is indeed the human condition that fosters the hunger and yearning for freedom. George W. Bush saw this coming back in 2003 as a sure thing. And now just turn on the TV and check it out. The pursuit of freedom is bursting out all over the place in the Middle East. . Dubya was right.


Christopher - Conservative Perspective said...

Only time will tell Fredd as it is much too early to draw such a conclusion in my opinion whilst things on the ground do not point the way to democracy or even more tyranny.

No, right now it is anarchy and mayhem. If and when the dust settles we can revisit the idea of Bush being right.

Do not misunderstand, I hope he was right but only the people in the Middle East can make that determination in their action's.

Fredd said...

Just speculation, Christopher. The mob is angry about not getting a decent life. They know enough that Mubarak is responsible. They also have Twitter, Face Book and YouTube to know that the mullahs are even worse in Iran.

I think they will end up with good old free market capitalism and an elected leader with term limits as a default when the mob is done with their work. Remember, the casbah was where capitalism started, they know in their Egyptian DNA how this has always been done before.

Nobody can out haggle an Egyptian camel salesman.

Christopher - Conservative Perspective said...

"Nobody can out haggle an Egyptian camel salesman"

That to must be speculation Fredd as it signals to me you have never dealt with a native of India either in the short term or long.

But I digress.

What Egyptians see in Iran are Persians not Arabs, they also see Shi'a not Sunni Islam therefore than can be no comparison.

What we and they see in the Arab Middle East (Iraq aside being we have not left,,yet) is a reoccurring cycle of dictators be they secular, fiefdoms or theocratic and no, repeat no democracy as the Quaran is not compatible with democracy.

Keep speculating Fredd but stay away from Wall Street as you will lose your pants.

Silverfiddle said...

Well, this is not going to be a western-style upheaval. When muslims in Egypt and other lands speak of freedom and justice, they do so from an Islamic standpoint. Muslim Brotherhood aside, consider what the average Egyptian believes:

According to a Pew opinion survey of Egyptians from June 2010, 59 percent said they back Islamists. Only 27% said they back modernizers. Half of Egyptians support Hamas. Thirty percent support Hizbullah and 20% support al Qaida. Moreover, 95% of them would welcome Islamic influence over their politics.

Eighty two percent of Egyptians support executing adulterers by stoning, 77% support whipping and cutting the hands off thieves. 84% support executing any Muslim who changes his religion. ( Caroline Glick)

So I wouldn't hold my breath. I do wish we would untangle ourselves from these rotten people (yes, I'm dreaming). We have been complicit in tyrants crushing their people.

If we disentangle ourselves and get out, they will be fighting and killing each other within a year or so.

talk of a great caliphate is exhilarating, until they realize each group has its own idea of how to do it and more importantly, who will be in charge.

Fredd said...


Time will tell, for sure. But we clearly see that the young Egyptians, the ones who are in the streets for the most part, value their Western goodies more than they value Islam: Twitter, Face Book and YouTube rule the day for all young folks everywhere.

And that is a decidedly Western thing that is counter to everything Islam seeks to impose.

Which will win out: the spiritual stuff or the material stuff with the young folks who are providing the energy behind all of this upheaval?

I would speculate that the Western materialism will win the day with Middle Eastern youth in the long run.

Silverfiddle said...

I hope you're right, Fredd.

And as to haggling skills, I'll put an Afghan up against any other salesman in the world.

Fredd said...


As far as haggling skills go, I just threw the 'Egyptian camel salesman' out there because it seemed to roll off the tongue easier than Afghani camel salesman...

WomanHonorThyself said...

hiya Fredd..thanks for visiting WHT.:).I have zero optimism for these so called revolutions..the majority of Muzlims are indoctrinated from youth to be anti Western and rabid anti semites....and hussein obama is leading the charge!...good post Fredd. I'm praying!

Anonymous said...

Well Fredd Egypt is in turmoil. Only time will tell. Based on the current state of affairs in the Middle East I am somewhat pessemistic. I hope I am wrong.

Anonymous said...

Oh and by the way can I get a link exchange? Dave ;)

Kid said...

Fredd, I read recently that Murabak is worth 70 Billion. Draw your conclusions. And just to say it again, let's not prop up brutal dictators out of fear of some 7th century barbarians.

Specifically, the people of Egypt see their dictator. Then they see that America is propping him up. They don't like America.

Fredd said...


I'm sure that Mubarak invested his salary as a general and then subsequently duly elected president (for 30 years, what are the odds?) wisely, and his portfolio reflects his financial prowess.

You're of course right. The guy is a thieving thug who deserves to face the mob. And we as Americans do indeed look like we are in bed with this criminal.

We need to throw him under the bus. Now.

Kid said...

Thanks Fredd. I'm not particularly smart, but even I can't get why the talking heads and Palin are so wrapped up in keeping the *horns* MB from getting in power. Oh gosh, radical islamists in the ME, whatever will we do.

It's so blatant that someone like Hannity who constantly claims to be a Reagan conservative, and I'm sure he is, follows this defective line of thought. They are following the same line of thought that the Liberals did in Reagan's day when they were wringing their hands of Reagan confronting the USSR.
Hey, Let's confront. In our time, on our terms. If that's what it boils down to, which I don't believe will happen anyway. Not even for Israel as far as that goes.

But 70 Billion. Where did he get 70 Billion ?? Wikileaks ought to get on That one. I'll bet you'll trip over a lot of American politicians on that road.

Fredd said...


I'm with your line of thought: the last administration to confront radical Islam was the Jefferson administration (the Barbary pirates, shores of Tripoli and all of that).

Or perhaps Reagan lobbing a few missiles into Khadafi's tent. But a confrontation with this unrelenting and irreconcilable enemy will come about. Sooner or later. On our terms or theirs. I would prefer it be on ours.

WomanHonorThyself said...

added u to my blogroll Fredd.Keep up the good fight!

Joe said...

Nobody loves a "good" dictator like the liberal/progressive left. They all have despotic leanings, themselves.

Fredd said...

Yeah, I lean that way too, Joe. I only like 'good' dictators. Now, 'evil' dictators, well that's a COMPLETELY different thing...

Liberals do indeed pick and choose as to which dictators they like and which they do not.

Just speaking for myself, dumb ol' Fredd, that is like differentiating between a 'good' cannibal vs a 'bad' cannibal. To me, it's potato, po-TAH-toe.